The subject has been briefly touched upon recently, but I want to make my opinion known and also invite people's thought's on standards of contest logos.
As we all know, there are certain quality standards to be adhered to with store logos.
I know that contests are slightly different, but I don't think that it should be such a free for all, with any designs welcome and the customer being left solely to choose which logo he/she thinks is the 'best' submission.
The traditional relationship between designer and client is one of ideas coming together, opinions and compromise.
I believe that it's in all of our interests to at least set the bar at a certain minimum standard, because I know for a fact that clients don't always make the right choices because after all they are not designers.
Some of the 'likes' on the ratings that i've seen on some contests are just plain bad decisions and these clients are like a kid in a sweet shop, and if they then ask for amendments etc etc, you can end up with a complete 'manbearpig' of a design which serves the interests of no-one but the deluded mindset of a client.
I apologise if this subject has been covered / or if the wheels of change are in motion, but hope you get my drift. The customer aint' king to a certain extent, and although they are ultimately consumers and know what they like, this doesn't and shouldn't serve as the only factor in getting them to a design which is right for their business.
We should at least strain out the totally crap designs / set a certain minimum standard for contests to give customers and their ego's at least a fighting chance of making a good(ish) decision. Maybe similar to the automatic approval system which is in place for the store logo uploads; new users or 'repeat offenders' should go through a turd vetting procedure before they can release their designs into the public domain.
I waffle, but welcome your thoughts....
18 Comments
I'm genuinely sorry to 'name names' but this is a classic example...
http://stocklogos.com/contest/tc-printing/100141
The client 'liked' this?! Am I right that this is a CRAZY choice which benefits no-one?
I hear what your saying, and I agree whole heartedly! However, how do you truly judge what is, and what is not 'crap' design? For all the logos that sell on this site that are deemed 'great' by site members such as yourself, Nancy, Xblue, Nekiy, Melanie, Molumen, Rockadero, Logosoul, etc etc etc... there are equally as many that sell that quite often fall into the 'not so good' category of design - if we're to believe what we read on the related threads anyway. This therefore raises an interesting dilemma in that some clients of this site are seeing value in some work that other site members may deride and deem 'crap'.
I totally agree. Crap to you might not be crap another's point of view, worse, to the world. Clients see their business to be represented by what you see as crap - they see another thing in that logo that we don't. Sometimes designers often make a mistake of judging another's creation. I saw an artwork once and labeled it as crap, only to turn out it was Matisse.
Yeah but fine art is a totally different kettle of fish.
Reiterating on my comment 'below' I just think that there should at least be a bottom line, as there isn't one currently, which could filter out the designs which break too many design rules - rules which are not subject to opinion. That's the real injustice to both client and designer, when a client can deem a design fit for purpose based on nothing other than their own misinformed whim. There needs to be a BASIC standard and opinion doesn't come into it.
It's not just about quality of design but integrity of the vector artwork. There is absolutely no QC in contests. No confirmation that the contributor is able to create the requires min standards: Was artwork was created in a vector program? Does it contain raster images or un-scalable effects? Fonts outlined? CMYK?
Nail > head!
Good points well made Nancy.
Well erm - yeah that too. I obviously only see things from the frontend and your points are more great reasons to put them under scrutiny.
+1
I agree. Unfortunately, not every client has what we might think is good taste. Ultimately the client has to be satisfied since they are spending money, even when we are not in agreement. Often during a contest if you notice the client seeming to like a few so called "crap" designs, it might steer you away from working to hard on it. Even if the client could see ratings by fellow designers, those ratings will have to be taken with a grain of salt since it is after all, a contest. We each have to way our own risk to continue on or not.
Thanks Phunkmonster, I hear that completely. It's a fine line and any solution needs to be on the right side of that line.
The site obviously doesn't want to shoot itself in the foot, but there needs to be a bottom line - surely. We are offering logos which are 95% for business use and leaving the client to make a choice out of a selection of COMPLETELY unsolicited logos is a bad thing. I say 'completely' as an extreme against your description of 'not so good'. I'm not looking to eliminate the bottom 40-50% of logos - or the not so good ones, but even if there are 5% which don't get through the BASIC quality standards, then it can only be a good thing for all parties.
Hard to implement - maybe, but we should discuss it.
The brief side of things is/will be a good discussion, but I've now got to go out and pick up my daughter from school. Otherwise I'd be all over this discussion. I'll join in later ;)
I agree. Please suggest a system that would allow us to do this fairly automatically and justly.
Well I don't think that automation is possible Ivan.
The only possible solutions would be to place all new users under a design standards check of their first submission at least, before they are able to submit designs without prior approval.
Other than that, a hidden, all user ratings system (1 to 10 stars or percentage for example) with designs below a certain rating getting deleted - obviously only after a certain amount of ratings are given, say 10 ratings for example, to give an honest reflection of consensus.
A private group (100 maybe) of trusted users with access to a similar, hidden ratings system? (the secret police) ;)
A public ratings system, which might aid the client in making their choice, but might alienate people and breed resentment, but you can't argue with the overall consensus..
On top of any of the above or as an alternative, any identified designs could be submitted to a forum post similar to the site violations post, for review by members and a vote on if the design gets deleted or not. Probably the easiest and most fair method.
I don't think new users should be able to enter contests. I think entrants should have a minimum # of approved designs in the store. That way quality and abilities have been checked.
100% Agree with you!
Even worst - the customer left with the impression that this is the quality of proposals from this site at all and he(she) retired frustrated retired from the start of hims contest.
And the contest freezing somehow with no feedback from the client.
I agree, but why not just migrate the approval process to the contests too. Or - ALL first and second logo submissions by new users are vetted and x amount of approved logos enables auto approval into the store or contests.
I just wouldn't want to put such a barrier in front of contests - it should be consistent across the board.
20% AGREE 80% DISAGREE
Fair is fair and being new does not guarantee crap. For example, I won my very first contest and another not long after. Not at all saying i'm so good or anything, but my point being that I got a fair shot. Besides who would be approving the minimum number of designs? What if you don't sell anything in the store and just do the contest?
The contest I just lost for the Law Practice Makers went to a designer who couldn't even spell the logo correctly. What the hell happened to professionalism and honor??